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Honorverse ramblings and musings

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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Kizarvexis   » Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:48 pm

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cthia wrote:What's eating Highlanders?


You forgot these lines right above the section you quoted. I bolded the important part.

Shadow of Saganami - Ch. 3 wrote:A junior-grade lieutenant with the brassard of the boat bay officer of the deck on her left arm and the name "MacIntyre, Freda" on her nameplate was waiting with an expression of semi-polite impatience, and all three of the midshipmen saluted her.
"Permission to come aboard to join the ship's company, Ma'am?" Ragnhild requested crisply.


Don't forget this section as Cpt Terekhov reviews who he assigned to Copenhagen for the scouting of Monica. And later as Cmdr FitzGerald sees how bad she is at annoying the experienced non-coms and ratings he is afraid that him and the Cpt will not be able to turn her attitude around. Since both of them see it, the non-coms and ratings surely do and I think it was some foreshadowing.


Shadow of Saganami - Ch. 50 wrote:Lieutenant MacIntyre would be along as FitzGerald's engineer, with Lieutenant Olivetti as his astrogator and Lieutenant Kobe to handle his communications. That was as many officers as Terekhov could spare, but it was still going to leave FitzGerald shorthanded, since only Olivetti was watch-qualified. MacIntyre and Kobe were both junior-grade lieutenants, capable enough in their specialties, but with limited experience. In fact, MacIntyre had something of a reputation for being sharp-tongued and waspish with enlisted personnel and noncoms. Terekhov suspected that it sprang from her own lack of self-confidence, and he hoped this assignment might help to turn that around.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by saber964   » Sat Mar 05, 2016 5:27 pm

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cthia wrote:Shadow of Saganami - Ch. 3
"As you know," Commander Ginger Lewis said, sitting very upright in the chair at the head of the table in the captain's briefing room immediately off of Hexapuma's bridge, "it's traditional for midshipmen and midshipwomen on their graduation cruises to be formally welcomed aboard their ships. Usually, that duty falls to either the executive officer or to the assistant tac officer, since she's normally the one who will serve as their officer candidate training officer for the deployment. Unfortunately, at the moment Commander FitzGerald, our XO, finds himself detained dealing with the yard dogs, and our ATO hasn't reported aboard yet. And so, Ladies and Gentlemen, you find yourselves stuck with me."

She smiled with a curious blend of impishness, sympathy, and cool command.

"I find myself at something of a disadvantage, in some ways," she continued, "because I never attended the Academy. I was directly commissioned, and they put me through OCS aboard Vulcan. As a result, I never made a snotty cruise, so this particular rite of passage is outside my direct personal experience."

Helen didn't move a single muscle, but she found herself studying Lewis much more intently. The commander looked young for her rank, even in a society with prolong. And now that Helen was paying attention to the medal ribbons on the breast of the Engineer's space-black tunic, she was impressed. They were headed by the Osterman Cross. The Osterman was about one notch below the Manticore Cross, and, like the MC, it could be awarded only for valor. Unlike the MC, however, it could be awarded only to enlisted personnel or noncommissioned officers. The Conspicuous Gallantry Medal kept the OC company, as did the red sleeve stripe which indicated the commander had been wounded in action and the additional stripe which indicated someone who had been mentioned in dispatches.

An impressive collection, Helen thought. And one which almost certainly helped explain Lewis' commission. The RMN had always had a higher percentage of "mustangs"—officers who'd been promoted from the enlisted ranks—than most navies, but it appeared Ginger Lewis was something out of the ordinary even for the Star Kingdom.

Can anyone, ex or present military, give me some personal chit-chat regarding the colour of officers comparatively - regular vs. 'mustangs?'

I find it logical that the RMN would have a higher percentage of Mustangs than most navies. I wonder where the RHN ranked in that respect?

Mustangss usually have the enlisted man's perspective on stuff. They usually have at least a couple years as a enlisted man before going to college and getting commissioned. They also get more respect from enlisted due to the fact that they've done the dirty work, been chewed out by sarge or chief,
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:35 pm

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Shadow of Saganami Ch.5
"I suppose both he and his father figure OFS would be put in charge of administering Manticore after a crushing military defeat," Anisimovna said.

"Exactly," Bardasano agreed. "And they figure their tame bureaucrats, like Verrochio—or Hongbo, I should say, since we all know who really pulls the strings—would be free to divvy up control of the Junction any way they wanted. And with enough money going into the right pockets . . ."

She shrugged, then smiled and tapped the elaborate stud in her left nostril with a fingertip before she popped the fish into her mouth.

What do you suppose is the significance of the stud in her nostril? Perhaps it deadens her sense of smell, because of some particular rancid, but delicious, local fish?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:41 pm

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Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:10 pm

Shadow of Saganami
"I wouldn't exactly be heartbroken if the Manties suffered a mischief." Anisimovna's tone's mildness fooled no one. "God knows they've been a big enough pain in the ass for as long as I can remember, even leaving aside our recent little misfortunes in Tiberian and Congo. But it's not as if the damned Peeps aren't just as a big a pain."

"For that matter, it was even more Haven than the Manties who engineered the Congo fuck-up," Bardasano said sourly, her smile of a moment before disappearing. The loss of the Congo Wormhole Junction before it could even be adequately surveyed had been almost as upsetting to the Jessyk Combine as the loss of Verdant Vista's slave-breeding facilities and pharmaceutical industry had been to Manpower.

"Agreed," Anisimovna

It seems like the stock in the remaining slaves would shoot up drastically. Law of supply and demand.

And the remaining slaves are probably shuttled around and bartered out to the highest bidder. I wonder what system, or system, has the largest population of slaves?

This suggests that there are still slaver ships running about. And if slaves are becoming the centerpiece of supply and demand then perhaps even Darius imports or exports slaves - a possible weak link in their veil of secrecy?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Duckk   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:49 pm

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Darius is explicitly explained as having an entirely homegrown population of slaves, precisely so there isn't any slave traffic.
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Shields at 50%, taunting at 100%! - Tom Pope
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:58 pm

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Duckk wrote:Darius is explicitly explained as having an entirely homegrown population of slaves, precisely so there isn't any slave traffic.

Which is why I employed a bit of foresight and covered both bases - import or export. If the availability of slaves is strained everywhere other than Darius, then there may be a leak in trade. The shady world that that entails has caused more governments problems than probably any other I can think of.

Daddy Detweiler says don't peddle the wares, but, well...

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:02 pm

cthia
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Posts: 14951
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cthia wrote:Shadow of Saganami - Ch. 3
"As you know," Commander Ginger Lewis said, sitting very upright in the chair at the head of the table in the captain's briefing room immediately off of Hexapuma's bridge, "it's traditional for midshipmen and midshipwomen on their graduation cruises to be formally welcomed aboard their ships. Usually, that duty falls to either the executive officer or to the assistant tac officer, since she's normally the one who will serve as their officer candidate training officer for the deployment. Unfortunately, at the moment Commander FitzGerald, our XO, finds himself detained dealing with the yard dogs, and our ATO hasn't reported aboard yet. And so, Ladies and Gentlemen, you find yourselves stuck with me."

She smiled with a curious blend of impishness, sympathy, and cool command.

"I find myself at something of a disadvantage, in some ways," she continued, "because I never attended the Academy. I was directly commissioned, and they put me through OCS aboard Vulcan. As a result, I never made a snotty cruise, so this particular rite of passage is outside my direct personal experience."

Helen didn't move a single muscle, but she found herself studying Lewis much more intently. The commander looked young for her rank, even in a society with prolong. And now that Helen was paying attention to the medal ribbons on the breast of the Engineer's space-black tunic, she was impressed. They were headed by the Osterman Cross. The Osterman was about one notch below the Manticore Cross, and, like the MC, it could be awarded only for valor. Unlike the MC, however, it could be awarded only to enlisted personnel or noncommissioned officers. The Conspicuous Gallantry Medal kept the OC company, as did the red sleeve stripe which indicated the commander had been wounded in action and the additional stripe which indicated someone who had been mentioned in dispatches.

An impressive collection, Helen thought. And one which almost certainly helped explain Lewis' commission. The RMN had always had a higher percentage of "mustangs"—officers who'd been promoted from the enlisted ranks—than most navies, but it appeared Ginger Lewis was something out of the ordinary even for the Star Kingdom.

Can anyone, ex or present military, give me some personal chit-chat regarding the colour of officers comparatively - regular vs. 'mustangs?'

I find it logical that the RMN would have a higher percentage of Mustangs than most navies. I wonder where the RHN ranked in that respect?


saber964 wrote:Mustangss usually have the enlisted man's perspective on stuff. They usually have at least a couple years as a enlisted man before going to college and getting commissioned. They also get more respect from enlisted due to the fact that they've done the dirty work, been chewed out by sarge or chief,

Thanks.

But is college a must for mustangs before getting commissioned? I get a feeling it isn't.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Duckk   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:12 pm

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cthia wrote:Which is why I employed a bit of foresight and covered both bases - import or export. If the availability of slaves is strained everywhere other than Darius, then there may be a leak in trade. The shady world that that entails has caused more governments problems than probably any other I can think of.

Daddy Detweiler says don't peddle the wares, but, well...



You're missing the point I'm trying to make. There is no traffic to or from Darius except for military traffic. That's the whole point of having a secret base. You don't want imported slaves from outside Darius to to contaminate the local population with foreign ideas about what Mesa is really doing. And you definitely don't want anyone from Darius being exported out where they can talk about some world no one has ever heard about engaging in mighty suspicious activities. Again, this is very clearly spelled out in the text, specifically MoH.

Furthermore, genetic slavery was a means to an end; it was never an end in itself. Genetic slavery is simply a tool to the Alignment. It gives them cover for their genetic experiments and their covert operations. The slave trade itself never mattered to their goals. The money never mattered to them - part of the reason Cachat and Zilwicki went to Mesa the first time was that the slave trade didn't make financial sense. So the Alignment isn't going to compromise Darius' security for something as irrelevant (to them) as the slave trade.
-------------------------
Shields at 50%, taunting at 100%! - Tom Pope
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Jonathan_S   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:54 pm

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Duckk wrote:You're missing the point I'm trying to make. There is no traffic to or from Darius except for military traffic. That's the whole point of having a secret base. You don't want imported slaves from outside Darius to to contaminate the local population with foreign ideas about what Mesa is really doing. And you definitely don't want anyone from Darius being exported out where they can talk about some world no one has ever heard about engaging in mighty suspicious activities. Again, this is very clearly spelled out in the text, specifically MoH.

Furthermore, genetic slavery was a means to an end; it was never an end in itself. Genetic slavery is simply a tool to the Alignment. It gives them cover for their genetic experiments and their covert operations. The slave trade itself never mattered to their goals. The money never mattered to them - part of the reason Cachat and Zilwicki went to Mesa the first time was that the slave trade didn't make financial sense. So the Alignment isn't going to compromise Darius' security for something as irrelevant (to them) as the slave trade.

To expand slightly on this, there were people the money in genetic slavery mattered to, but they'd have been in Manpower and way, way, outside the onion. The existinance of Darius has been carefully compartmented away from them; they've no clue it might even exists.

So all the profit motive in the galaxy can't cause them to try to sneak slaves out of a place they don't know exists; and have no access to.

They may try to set up breeding centers in former distribution sites; or attempt to acquire the tools on the black market to continue growing custom designed slaves. (Or even try to sneak such equipment; or the DNA libraries of existing slave lines off of Mesa before the GA fully locks it down). But none of that should be able to lead the GA to the true MAlign.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by saber964   » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:42 pm

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Admiral

Posts: 2423
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 8:41 pm
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cthia wrote:
cthia"Shadow of Saganami - Ch. 3
[quote]
"As you know," Commander Ginger Lewis said, sitting very upright in the chair at the head of the table in the captain's briefing room immediately off of Hexapuma's bridge, "it's traditional for midshipmen and midshipwomen on their graduation cruises to be formally welcomed aboard their ships. Usually, that duty falls to either the executive officer or to the assistant tac officer, since she's normally the one who will serve as their officer candidate training officer for the deployment. Unfortunately, at the moment Commander FitzGerald, our XO, finds himself detained dealing with the yard dogs, and our ATO hasn't reported aboard yet. And so, Ladies and Gentlemen, you find yourselves stuck with me."

She smiled with a curious blend of impishness, sympathy, and cool command.

"I find myself at something of a disadvantage, in some ways," she continued, "because I never attended the Academy. I was directly commissioned, and they put me through OCS aboard Vulcan. As a result, I never made a snotty cruise, so this particular rite of passage is outside my direct personal experience."

Helen didn't move a single muscle, but she found herself studying Lewis much more intently. The commander looked young for her rank, even in a society with prolong. And now that Helen was paying attention to the medal ribbons on the breast of the Engineer's space-black tunic, she was impressed. They were headed by the Osterman Cross. The Osterman was about one notch below the Manticore Cross, and, like the MC, it could be awarded only for valor. Unlike the MC, however, it could be awarded only to enlisted personnel or noncommissioned officers. The Conspicuous Gallantry Medal kept the OC company, as did the red sleeve stripe which indicated the commander had been wounded in action and the additional stripe which indicated someone who had been mentioned in dispatches.

An impressive collection, Helen thought. And one which almost certainly helped explain Lewis' commission. The RMN had always had a higher percentage of "mustangs"—officers who'd been promoted from the enlisted ranks—than most navies, but it appeared Ginger Lewis was something out of the ordinary even for the Star Kingdom.

Can anyone, ex or present military, give me some personal chit-chat regarding the colour of officers comparatively - regular vs. 'mustangs?'

I find it logical that the RMN would have a higher percentage of Mustangs than most navies. I wonder where the RHN ranked in that respect?


[quote="saber964 wrote:Mustangss usually have the enlisted man's perspective on stuff. They usually have at least a couple years as a enlisted man before going to college and getting commissioned. They also get more respect from enlisted due to the fact that they've done the dirty work, been chewed out by sarge or chief,

Thanks.

But is college a must for mustangs before getting commissioned? I get a feeling it isn't.[/quote]


For the most part yes they do have to go to college. But under wartime conditions it's you could receive a battlefield commission to fill in gaps in the chain of command. IIRC Audie Murphy was sergeant before he received his commission. But those who received battlefield commissions rarely rose higher than O-3 Captain/Lieutenant without a college degree.
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