What happens to all that debris?

cthia wrote:Now, for the important part of this post ...

Isn't spoiler season over? The rules say one month after publishing. Right? The official release date was Oct. 5. I am waiting for a signal from the game warden. Duckk.

Huh, I guess the spoiler rules got loosened significantly. I swear they used to remain in effect until a while after the paperback was published. (in deference to those who might not be willing or able to get the hardcover)

Though that meant that snerk/spoiler protections might be in effect for around 2 years from the first snippets until however long after the paperback released.

Wonder when that rule got changed?

Jonathan_S wrote:

cthia wrote:Now, for the important part of this post ...

Isn't spoiler season over? The rules say one month after publishing. Right? The official release date was Oct. 5. I am waiting for a signal from the game warden. Duckk.

Huh, I guess the spoiler rules got loosened significantly. I swear they used to remain in effect until a while after the paperback was published. (in deference to those who might not be willing or able to get the hardcover)

Though that meant that snerk/spoiler protections might be in effect for around 2 years from the first snippets until however long after the paperback released.

Wonder when that rule got changed?

Dunno when it got changed. But as far as the hardback and paperback the rules presently say one month after publication date of either, whichever book comes first.

I'll idle a bit longer, but I'll keep my impellers hot. I am just a bit busy anyway with family stuff. This is the period of one of our most important private powwows. It was cancelled last year because of the pandemic.

cthia wrote:Now, for the important part of this post ...

Isn't spoiler season over? The rules say one month after publishing. Right? The official release date was Oct. 5. I am waiting for a signal from the game warden. Duckk.

Jonathan_S wrote:Huh, I guess the spoiler rules got loosened significantly. I swear they used to remain in effect until a while after the paperback was published. (in deference to those who might not be willing or able to get the hardcover)

Though that meant that snerk/spoiler protections might be in effect for around 2 years from the first snippets until however long after the paperback released.

Wonder when that rule got changed?

cthia wrote:Dunno when it got changed. But as far as the hardback and paperback the rules presently say one month after publication date of either, whichever book comes first.

I'll idle a bit longer, but I'll keep my impellers hot. I am just a bit busy anyway with family stuff. This is the period of one of our most important private powwows. It was cancelled last year because of the pandemic.

I do know that a post made Sunday, Nov 07, 2021 7:43 pm by Fester in the "Building BSDF" thread was editted by Duckk to remove a spoiler. That spoiler was just the name of a planet that we had not previously known.

From [ Uncompromising Honor"

“It looks like they took out at least ninety percent of the superdreadnoughts in Reserve One.”
“The Reserve?” This time it was Haeckle, and Tsukatani nodded.
“They have to have done it on purpose, Sir. Not only that, they punched their birds right through our defensive envelope to reach them, and they didn’t have to do that. They brought them into range of our CMs and every one of our platforms’ point defense clusters, and with their laserheads’ standoff range, they could’ve stayed entirely out of our counter-missile envelope, far less laser range, if they’d wanted to.”
“A message,” Haeckle said softly. “They were sending a message.”
His brain raced. He hadn’t even thought about the thousands of obsolescent superdreadnoughts parked in the twenty-four, equidistantly spaced clusters riding Jupiter orbit with Ganymede. Why should he have?

----
That was 2700 Mk 23s.....and took out "thousands of obsolescent super dreadnoughts " after going through the entire CM and point defence gauntlet . 2700 missiles took out thousands of SDs. No mention of if they used the warheads as contact weapons or standard (multi lasting rod) laserhead. In any case, there "too out" what they were shooting at. I suspect that the reserve fleet has not been a powered off, nitrogen flooded bunch of hulls. If even one reactor on each ship was maintained to keep power on for stationkeeping and minimal gas pressure in areas not needed to the caretaking crews to do periodic maintenance, the Mk 23s could have been aiming at the live reactors on each ship and there wasn't all that much usable after that.

Brigade XO wrote:From [ Uncompromising Honor"

“It looks like they took out at least ninety percent of the superdreadnoughts in Reserve One.”
“The Reserve?” This time it was Haeckle, and Tsukatani nodded.
“They have to have done it on purpose, Sir. Not only that, they punched their birds right through our defensive envelope to reach them, and they didn’t have to do that. They brought them into range of our CMs and every one of our platforms’ point defense clusters, and with their laserheads’ standoff range, they could’ve stayed entirely out of our counter-missile envelope, far less laser range, if they’d wanted to.”
“A message,” Haeckle said softly. “They were sending a message.”
His brain raced. He hadn’t even thought about the thousands of obsolescent superdreadnoughts parked in the twenty-four, equidistantly spaced clusters riding Jupiter orbit with Ganymede. Why should he have?

----
That was 2700 Mk 23s.....and took out "thousands of obsolescent super dreadnoughts " after going through the entire CM and point defence gauntlet . 2700 missiles took out thousands of SDs. No mention of if they used the warheads as contact weapons or standard (multi lasting rod) laserhead. In any case, there "too out" what they were shooting at. I suspect that the reserve fleet has not been a powered off, nitrogen flooded bunch of hulls. If even one reactor on each ship was maintained to keep power on for stationkeeping and minimal gas pressure in areas not needed to the caretaking crews to do periodic maintenance, the Mk 23s could have been aiming at the live reactors on each ship and there wasn't all that much usable after that.

Nice textev XO. And right on time with what I was thinking. I don't recall Honor giving a warning and the required amount of time for any station keeping crew aboard the mothballs to escape. If there were a minimal crew aboard each ship, wouldn't Honor have given them time to flee? After all, there was no need to kill thousands of spacers aboard useless ships. But then, iinm, she took out the reserve before Hamish arrived to soothe the savage beast. No?

Brigade XO wrote:From [ Uncompromising Honor"

“It looks like they took out at least ninety percent of the superdreadnoughts in Reserve One.”
“The Reserve?” This time it was Haeckle, and Tsukatani nodded.
“They have to have done it on purpose, Sir. Not only that, they punched their birds right through our defensive envelope to reach them, and they didn’t have to do that. They brought them into range of our CMs and every one of our platforms’ point defense clusters, and with their laserheads’ standoff range, they could’ve stayed entirely out of our counter-missile envelope, far less laser range, if they’d wanted to.”
“A message,” Haeckle said softly. “They were sending a message.”
His brain raced. He hadn’t even thought about the thousands of obsolescent superdreadnoughts parked in the twenty-four, equidistantly spaced clusters riding Jupiter orbit with Ganymede. Why should he have?

----
That was 2700 Mk 23s.....and took out "thousands of obsolescent super dreadnoughts " after going through the entire CM and point defence gauntlet . 2700 missiles took out thousands of SDs. No mention of if they used the warheads as contact weapons or standard (multi lasting rod) laserhead. In any case, there "too out" what they were shooting at. I suspect that the reserve fleet has not been a powered off, nitrogen flooded bunch of hulls. If even one reactor on each ship was maintained to keep power on for stationkeeping and minimal gas pressure in areas not needed to the caretaking crews to do periodic maintenance, the Mk 23s could have been aiming at the live reactors on each ship and there wasn't all that much usable after that.

With thousands of Mk23s killing thousands of SDs they might even have gone for wedge contact kills.

And potentially you might even be able to use that without excessively endangering any caretaking crew that might be aboard.

For example if you use a missile's wedge to guillotine off one of the hammerheads and adjacent impeller rings that SD isn't going to be good for anything but scrap. But that would only minimally damage crew quarters, fusion reactors, the bridge, etc. It'd presumably kill any crew that might be standing watch in those impeller rooms - but there wouldn't be much call for that if the ships are mothballed and not expected to move or fight without significant refurbishment. (Well, if it had the appropriate crew aboard it might still be able to bring up its reactors and weapons - but Honor's way outside the missile range of those obsolete junkers, and anyway they're not likely to have anything in their magazines while mothballed)

A wedge impact would do more damage than even a contact nuke (which is why that was the original "warhead" for anti-ship missiles until the sidewall was developed to block it. But it could do that damage in a more localized area (depending on how careful the missile was about where the wedge impacted the target)

cthia wrote:A layer of specialized coating is what I posited upstream with "plating." Akin to gold-plating. I can conceive of a simple spray coating that protects the metal and other susceptible parts, but which is easily removed if need be. As on present day Terra, no doubt there is a certain amount of time required to "demothball."

Protect from what? Metal doesn't rust in space because there is no oxygen to react with.

There's ultraviolet and high-energy photons from the solar wind, but I doubt a layer of coating would help there. If something like that did, it would be in place for the ship's actual service, not added during mothballing process. Maybe it does exist for the service and needs to be redone every 10 years of service or 50 years of mothball.

Pitting by micrometeriorites wouldn't be stopped by a coat of paint either. That's what the armour is there for.

Externally, what I expect the mothball process to do is to ensure all missile tube ports and PDLCs are covered, and if any treatment is required on the hinges and seams, for that to be done too. But the rest of the surface of the ship is probably fine as is.

Brigade XO wrote:That was 2700 Mk 23s.....and took out "thousands of obsolescent super dreadnoughts " after going through the entire CM and point defence gauntlet . 2700 missiles took out thousands of SDs. No mention of if they used the warheads as contact weapons or standard (multi lasting rod) laserhead. In any case, there "too out" what they were shooting at. I suspect that the reserve fleet has not been a powered off, nitrogen flooded bunch of hulls. If even one reactor on each ship was maintained to keep power on for stationkeeping and minimal gas pressure in areas not needed to the caretaking crews to do periodic maintenance, the Mk 23s could have been aiming at the live reactors on each ship and there wasn't all that much usable after that.

Well, it looks like almost none of them got intercepted. So if 2500 missiles made it through to firing range, they could easily destroy 2000 ships at less than 1.0 kill ratio per missile. And that's "thousands of ships," not even having to address figures of speech.

Each missile can fire more than one beam so against unpowered targets, it's entirely possible to achieve better than 1.0 kill ratio. But as discussed before, a single beam is unlikely to explode the ship. Eight of them might.

That said, wedge kills make far more sense.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

cthia wrote:A layer of specialized coating is what I posited upstream with "plating." Akin to gold-plating. I can conceive of a simple spray coating that protects the metal and other susceptible parts, but which is easily removed if need be. As on present day Terra, no doubt there is a certain amount of time required to "demothball."

Protect from what? Metal doesn't rust in space because there is no oxygen to react with.

There's ultraviolet and high-energy photons from the solar wind, but I doubt a layer of coating would help there. If something like that did, it would be in place for the ship's actual service, not added during mothballing process. Maybe it does exist for the service and needs to be redone every 10 years of service or 50 years of mothball.

Pitting by micrometeriorites wouldn't be stopped by a coat of paint either. That's what the armour is there for.

Externally, what I expect the mothball process to do is to ensure all missile tube ports and PDLCs are covered, and if any treatment is required on the hinges and seams, for that to be done too. But the rest of the surface of the ship is probably fine as is.

You dropped the ball upstream following the conversation. Protect from oxygen, if pressurization is the norm along with a breathable atmosphere. Which, btw Jonathan, if there is a small crew aboard it is going to be a bitch to have to perform their duties in a spacesuit all of the time in a nitrogen environment.

But again, if there was a small crew aboard thousands of ships, Honor killed a lot of unnecessary people needlessly.

cthia wrote:You dropped the ball upstream following the conversation. Protect from oxygen, if pressurization is the norm along with a breathable atmosphere. Which, btw Jonathan, if there is a small crew aboard it is going to be a bitch to have to perform their duties in a spacesuit all of the time in a nitrogen environment.

But again, if there was a small crew aboard thousands of ships, Honor killed a lot of unnecessary people needlessly.

Again, what oxygen? There's none on the outside and we talked about having a pure nitrogen atmosphere on the inside.

Yes, that makes it impossible to do shortsleeve working, but is that necessary? How often must a live crew board a ship, instead of sending remotes for inspection? If they must come on-board to repair, can't they then and only then pump oxygen in, then remove again? And only to the portions that they need access to?