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GOD EXISTS

For anyone who might want to have a side conversation...you're welcome here!
Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by TN4994   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:35 am

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Shakespeare wrote "To be, or not to be...." pertaining to Hamlet's thoughts on the human condition.
In the Judeo-Christian-Muslim teaching there is only one god.
But the texts speak of more than one. Interpretive translation is everything.
God may well be a collective noun, describing a coporation's board meeting.
In the begining there was the idea, to create mankind, and give them a place to live.
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by smr   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:58 am

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God - the being or force that willed the universe into existence.

@Daryl

Their is a difference between religion and having a relationship with God. Most of us create the chains that weigh us down in reality. I am sorry that you have no faith in God. The only thing is that all this hate you have towards people of faith it's dragging you down. It's time to forgive those that have wrongfully hurt you. The reason to forgive is for you to be grow as a human being and not let the soulless or evil people stamp out your light and dictate your actions. It's easy to say "forgive" but hard to apply in life. In my case, it's abuse as a child! When I think about all those years of abuse, I really just want to shut down as an individual. It has taken a long time for me to forgive but my life is 1000% better for being able to forgive!
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by Annachie   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 5:05 am

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The pilgrims fled England for a land where they could practice religious persecution. Subtle difference.

Cthia, what happens to your thought experiment when you extend it to God? Don't you end up at the same void? Wouldn't Occam's razor say then that there is no God is the answer? (actually the answer is we don't know enough to conduct the first thought experiment, let alone the follow up one)

It's a trivial challange to show that the bible is the work of man, though the inspiration behind it is a different story.

Just as it's a trivial challange to show that the vast majority of those who follow it pick and choose what to follow based on their own prejudices.

But I leave you this thought. What kind and loving God would deny his chosen people the glory that is bacon? :)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You are so going to die. :p ~~~~ runsforcelery
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still not dead. :)
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by smr   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 5:20 am

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Annachie wrote:The pilgrims fled England for a land where they could practice religious persecution. Subtle difference.

Cthia, what happens to your thought experiment when you extend it to God? Don't you end up at the same void? Wouldn't Occam's razor say then that there is no God is the answer? (actually the answer is we don't know enough to conduct the first thought experiment, let alone the follow up one)

It's a trivial challange to show that the bible is the work of man, though the inspiration behind it is a different story.

Just as it's a trivial challange to show that the vast majority of those who follow it pick and choose what to follow based on their own prejudices.

But I leave you this thought. What kind and loving God would deny his chosen people the glory that is bacon? :)


How about bacon wrapped sausage? Hmmmm! I'm getting hungry! No offense offered to believers that shun bacon but I would have to pass on that particular religion or a religion that encourages canibilism.
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by Daryl   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 7:19 am

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Reminds me of the dyslexic atheist. Didn't believe in dogs.

It's not just my 50 year ago bad experiences that inform my thinking regarding Christians. Apart from those who attend revivalist born again churches the very great majority of Australians don't publically discuss their personal religion. Someone declaring "GOD EXISTS" publically would quickly find that everyone around them had left.

At a social gathering a while ago the discussion unusually turned to religion and business ethics, and it was surprising to find that everyone there avoided businesses that had that funny little fish symbol in their yellow page ads or elsewhere. This was because we had all been ripped off by such businesses.
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by biochem   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:08 am

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Daryl wrote:Reminds me of the dyslexic atheist. Didn't believe in dogs.

It's not just my 50 year ago bad experiences that inform my thinking regarding Christians. Apart from those who attend revivalist born again churches the very great majority of Australians don't publically discuss their personal religion. Someone declaring "GOD EXISTS" publically would quickly find that everyone around them had left.

At a social gathering a while ago the discussion unusually turned to religion and business ethics, and it was surprising to find that everyone there avoided businesses that had that funny little fish symbol in their yellow page ads or elsewhere. This was because we had all been ripped off by such businesses.


There is a difference between Christians, false Christians and Jesus Christ. Christians are human beings. We are fallible. We make all kinds of human mistakes and commit human sins. Sometimes those sins are egregious. Those of us who truly believe that Jesus Christ is our Savior do our best to understand the Bible and live our lives by the principles contained within. However because we are human our understanding is influenced by our humanity and is therefore imperfect. In that search we often interpret the Bible differently from one another. For example as you may have noticed cthia and I do not interpret the Bible in the same manner. That is our humanity speaking. But in spite of our doctrinal differences we are both true believing Christians who have chosen to trust Jesus Christ with our lives.

False Christians are those who put on an often convincing show. They are very public about beliefs they do not truly believe in for their own personal reasons (desire to create trust, gain power etc). It is rather hard for those of us humans to separate truly believing Christians who are screwing up badly from false Christians. I certainly can't. But God knows what is in their hearts and there will be a reckoning. He is very clear on that in the Bible. Ultimately at the end of days his justice will be perfect.

Jesus Christ is not the same as Christians. We Christians are human. We sin. We misinterpret the Bible (no human has a complete understanding of God's mind, so every last one of is is making doctrinal mistakes). Christ however is not human. He is perfect and does not suffer from our human failings. At times the Church has failed him badly by it's human sins. We have failed to represent him to the greater world in the manner in which we should. Those sins you have mentioned are human sins and Christ is not happy with us for committing them.
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by cthia   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:17 am

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biochem wrote:
Daryl wrote:
Reminds me of the dyslexic atheist. Didn't believe in dogs.

It's not just my 50 year ago bad experiences that inform my thinking regarding Christians. Apart from those who attend revivalist born again churches the very great majority of Australians don't publically discuss their personal religion. Someone declaring "GOD EXISTS" publically would quickly find that everyone around them had left.

At a social gathering a while ago the discussion unusually turned to religion and business ethics, and it was surprising to find that everyone there avoided businesses that had that funny little fish symbol in their yellow page ads or elsewhere. This was because we had all been ripped off by such businesses.


There is a difference between Christians, false Christians and Jesus Christ. Christians are human beings. We are fallible. We make all kinds of human mistakes and commit human sins. Sometimes those sins are egregious. Those of us who truly believe that Jesus Christ is our Savior do our best to understand the Bible and live our lives by the principles contained within. However because we are human our understanding is influenced by our humanity and is therefore imperfect. In that search we often interpret the Bible differently from one another. For example as you may have noticed cthia and I do not interpret the Bible in the same manner. That is our humanity speaking. But in spite of our doctrinal differences we are both true believing Christians who have chosen to trust Jesus Christ with our lives.

False Christians are those who put on an often convincing show. They are very public about beliefs they do not truly believe in for their own personal reasons (desire to create trust, gain power etc). It is rather hard for those of us humans to separate truly believing Christians who are screwing up badly from false Christians. I certainly can't. But God knows what is in their hearts and there will be a reckoning. He is very clear on that in the Bible. Ultimately at the end of days his justice will be perfect.

Jesus Christ is not the same as Christians. We Christians are human. We sin. We misinterpret the Bible (no human has a complete understanding of God's mind, so every last one of is is making doctrinal mistakes). Christ however is not human. He is perfect and does not suffer from our human failings. At times the Church has failed him badly by it's human sins. We have failed to represent him to the greater world in the manner in which we should. Those sins you have mentioned are human sins and Christ is not happy with us for committing them.

Can I get an Amen!

Amen.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by pokermind   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 12:09 pm

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Many diseases and parasites that effect swine also effect humans, thus abstaining from pork had a positive survival value in ancient times. Thus those who obeyed the restrictions of the religion had fewer health problems than those who did not practice them, proving God exists to those who held the dietary restrictions.

Obviously God was the first observational scientist ;)

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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by cthia   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 12:54 pm

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I often wonder if people who are not believers of GOD and are bashers of Christians, have truly met one of GOD's followers.

Matthew 7:21-23 King James Version (KJV)

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

There are many people, *zealots, who claim to be Christians — whose tongue and character is as forked as the horned one himself. There are many, who claim to be Christians, who only use the Bible as an extension to who they really are, as an authorization to bully. These people, my friends, are not Christians.

Evil is like dust. It invades everything that is not hermetically sealed. A soul becoming truly saved is a kind of hermetic seal against the dust of evil. It may settle on, but never permeate the core of a true Christian.

Many who claim to be righteous are workers of iniquity and they rightfully believe there is only one GOD. Good for them. But hearken ...
James 2:19 KJV
Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

It is as a Christian to believe, and belief is as an extension of faith. The biggest success will not occur until you believe. Even unto yourself. But one's belief in GOD is no guarantee of acceptance into Heaven. The demons also believe yet they are sure to be punished. Claiming to know GOD will not secure one a ticket to Heaven. Demons know GOD with more clarity than humans do. It is why they shudder and tremble. Remember, Lucifer was once the Right Hand of GOD.

True Christians are born again Christians.
To be born again is to undergo a "spiritual rebirth" (regeneration) of the human spirit from the Holy Spirit, contrasted with the physical birth everyone experiences.
King James Bible
Hebrews:9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.


A true Christian must believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and that Jesus paid the full price of our sins when he died on the cross. We must repent of our sins and ask that Jesus come into our life and we accept him as our saviour. We cannot make Jesus our saviour, but we can accept him. And we must be born again. And then the old you must truly die and our temple (self) become clean. Then shall we receive the true blessing of the Holy Spirit and we are saved.
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (KJV Bible)


****** *

My aunt. She leaves not a shadow or darkness of doubt that she is a true born again Christian. She doesn't have to tell you. You can see it. You can feel it. Upon entering my aunt's home, there is peace. You feel peace. Your burdens become light. A smile occupies my face and offers to permeate my soul with happiness. Visiting my aunt is a cleansing. Tears slide down my face like rain.

O ye of little faith, what GOD can do for those who truly believe. When you meet someone like this, you will know. They have a protective wedge about their body and a transponder above their heads broadcasting love. Agape love.

****** *

*zealots.
vir·tu·ous
ˈvərCHo͞oəs/
adjective
having or showing high moral standards.
synonyms: righteous, good, pure, whiter than white, saintly, angelic, moral, ethical, upright.

I have always been leery of using this noun. It has come to mean other than what it truly is. All of the characteristics of a zealot are good. In a Christian's ever raging battle against powers and principalities, we ... must ... not ... yield in preventing evil from permeating our space. It is when a Christian, or proclaimed, invades another's space, when the label of zealot is applied - but oftentimes, unfairly to us all.

Satan is crafty and full of deceitful Trojan horses and will mess up a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. But don't blame all PB&Js. They're actually quite good.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: GOD EXISTS
Post by TN4994   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:22 pm

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[quote="cthia"]I often wonder if people who are not believers of GOD and are bashers of Christians, have truly met one of GOD's followers.

[quote]
Matthew 7:21-23 King James Version (KJV)

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

There are many people, *zealots, who claim to be Christians — whose tongue and character is as forked as the horned one himself. There are many, who claim to be Christians, who only use the Bible as an extension to who they really are, as an authorization to bully. These people, my friends, are not Christians.

Evil is like dust. It invades everything that is not hermetically sealed. A soul becoming truly saved is a kind of hermetic seal against the dust of evil. It may settle on, but never permeate the core of a true Christian.

Many who claim to be righteous are workers of iniquity and they rightfully believe there is only one GOD. Good for them. But hearken ...
[quote]
James 2:19 KJV

To truly understand the books, aquire photoglyphs of the original texts and translate. Do not take it verbatim that the English text is accurate. The term lucifer is latin and has nothing to do with the tempter of wants and needs. As those who use the phrase "Jesus Christ, the Messiah", do not know of their error in pronunciation or the redundancy of the statement.
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