Impeachment now certain

Michael Everett wrote:I find that amusing given the recent rush of people celebrating that Trump has been impeached even though he hasn't been.

Impeachment is the act of a legislative body leveling charges against a government official, so he has in fact been impeached.

Michael Everett wrote:

gcomeau wrote:And that's how Trump keeps his base blissfully ignorant and believing anything he spouts.

I find that amusing given the recent rush of people celebrating that Trump has been impeached even though he hasn't been.

Trump has in fact really been impeached. Whether the Senate removes him as a result is a separate issue. The House and the House alone impeaches, the Constitution is clear and explicit on that point . When they voted to impeach, he was impeached. So you have just provided another example of exactly what I was pointing out.

It appears that President Trump has not been impeached:

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... -democrats

Until such time as Nutty Nancy appoints members of the House to manage an impeachment trial and transmits articles of Impeachment to the Senate, she has not met the Constitutional requirements.

TFLYTSNBN wrote:It appears that President Trump has not been impeached:

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... -democrats

Until such time as Nutty Nancy appoints members of the House to manage an impeachment trial and transmits articles of Impeachment to the Senate, she has not met the Constitutional requirements.

That's an opinion piece

A serious minority opinion.

Given that nothing would be happening right now anyways, it's more of a technical curiosity. The only way it matters is if the process is never started in the Senate and that's vanishingly unlikely.

If they wanted this to linger, they'd have waited for the SC rule on the various matters relating to impeachment.

From afar, it appears that the one sure loser is faith in the US justice system. The Democrat controlled Congress, says "Guilty" and the Republican controlled Senate will say "Not Guilty".
There will be lip service paid to the facts of the case, but in reality it will come down to political posturing on both sides.
With the US claiming the moral high ground internationally, this will cost them a lot of credibility.

Daryl wrote:From afar, it appears that the one sure loser is faith in the US justice system. The Democrat controlled Congress, says "Guilty" and the Republican controlled Senate will say "Not Guilty".
There will be lip service paid to the facts of the case, but in reality it will come down to political posturing on both sides.
With the US claiming the moral high ground internationally, this will cost them a lot of credibility.

Now this is a statement that I can absolutely agree with!

Nutty Nancy KNOWS that the Impeachment in the House of Representatives followed by a trial in the Senate is a political process more than a legal process. She KNOWS that the Republican controlled Senate is NOT going to convict President Trump for having the marginally questionable judgement to ask a foreign leader to demonstrate that their government is not utterly corrupt. The fact that the corruption in question involved a sitting Vice President demanding that a Ukrainian oil and gas company give his cocaine addicted son a multimillion dollar per year job that he was manifestly unqualified for as a precondition to receive Billions of dollars in foreign aid should make this a huge embarrassment for the Democrats. It will become even more embarrassing if Biden becomes the nominee. Even more embarrassing is the fact that ALL of the Democrats were colluding to conceal the Biden corruption.


You are also absolutely correct that impeachment process undermines the credibility of the US as well as President Trump. This is why I was livid about the entire " Russia Hacked the election" BS. Whatever Russia might have done to support Trump is no more sinister than all of the foreigners who post on this forum to support Democrats. The gratuitous damage from the investigations was all the more egregious because we now know that the principal FBI, CIA and State Department bureaucrats who fabricated the scandall were motivated primarily by their own political biases.

To be blunt, the one diplomatic relationship that is most crucial to the US is the relationship with Russia. Russia is the only country with the overt capacity to destroy the US. Russia is also FUBARed by its demographics and geography. The coming imploosion of Russia will be just as dangerous as the implosion of the Warsaw Pact and the USSR. The US does NOT want Russia to launch a nuclear death spasm. The POTUS needs to be at liberty to communicate with Russia and meet with Putin without the Democrats undermining him with false allegations of collusion.

China's overt strategic nuclear arsenal is not so formidable, but there is evidence that they have a much larger covert arsenal. China's "theater nuclear arsenal" enhances their strategic arsenal. China also has acquired the economic capacity to massively expand its nuclear arsenal. The IRNF agreement deprives the US of the ability to counter China's IRBMs and cruise missiles. POTUS needs to be at liberty to meet with China.

Since the "BUSH LIED, PEOPLE DIED" mantra ensured that the US would not be able to confront North Korea militarily, President Trump needs to be at liberty to negotiate with Kim. In case you haven't noticed, Trump is attempting to persuade North Korea to abandon its allegiance to China and maybe align itself or even reunify with South Korea. Alternatively; Trump will respond to North Korea by encouraging South Korea, Japan and Taiwan to acquire nuclear arsenals.

It might interest you to know that my little daughter worked on Senator MacCain's campaign staff back in 2016. She was on occasion his chauffeur. She knew him well enough that she was invited to his funeral. My daughter probably drove MacCain to the airport when he went to fetch the Steele dossier. (In addition to carrying a concealed pistol, she always kept a Ruger Mini-14 with about a half dozen 30 round clips in her Subaru. Any attack on the Senator would have resulted in a spectacular gun battle.). I do not share my daughter's high opinion of McCain but it saddens me to see these usurpers exploit a dodderring old fool.

Daryl wrote:From afar, it appears that the one sure loser is faith in the US justice system. The Democrat controlled Congress, says "Guilty" and the Republican controlled Senate will say "Not Guilty".
There will be lip service paid to the facts of the case, but in reality it will come down to political posturing on both sides.
With the US claiming the moral high ground internationally, this will cost them a lot of credibility.

Except this has nothing to do with the justice system. Impeachment is a political solution to matters outside the jurisdiction of the justice system. As such, it shakes the foundations of the country, but the justice system (judiciary) are about the only ones that come out of this looking halfway decent.

You know, it al started to remind me a "The cat and the chief" tale from Krylov. In which cat stole a steak that chief was cooking, and chief started to berate the cat, applying to its better nature, scolding it for succumbing to the sins of stealing & gluttony, citing Bible, ect.

The cat listened very carefully and continued to eat.

Why the Impeachment will ultimately fail?

We have the transcript of phone call. The United States has a Treaty with Ukraine. That treaty supersedes US Law. This treaty knocks out Article 1 of the Impeachment articles because Treaty obligations clear Trump. Two, Article 2 is probably going to thrown out by the courts. Why? America has 3 branches of Government. When the Executive and the Legislative Branches have disputes. The Judicial Branch resolves the disputes. So Article 2 of the Impeachment will be thrown out by the courts. The Courts will not cut their own throats. The House decided to ignore the Courts while trying to get Trump. Ultimately, the Courts will throw the 2nd Article of Impeachment.