Light bulb Captured Solly fleet

A note for those who are suggesting a use for the surrendered SLN ships, ART has two examples of 4th tier system forces.

Zunker - Hardscabble verge system, flush with cash from Wormhole discovered 15 years ago.

Total Space Navy: Little more than a double handful of LACs


Limbo - Independent system implied in text that it is an OFS client

Space Navy: two DDs, one of which is inoperable; 8 LACs all over 50 years old

How well does anyone think those two systems could utilize the surrendered ships even if they were given them?

Hi KZT,

As I recall, the 68 that created all the buzz before Crandall and Filareta's little faux pas' were essentially in one piece, enough to cause all kinds of speculation at the bar etc, intact enough we learned, to be generously returned in ART, and eagerly received.

L

kzt wrote:

lyonheart wrote:Given the various explanations if not excuses of what happened to Lester's undamaged 68 RHN SDP's after the BoMA or First Manticore [though it wasn't], some of us old bar hands suspect RFC has something underhanded, NTM nefarious in mind for all the SLN ships the GA has and will capture.

There was more like a dozen undamaged RHN ships in 2nd fleet at the end, with another dozen or two lightly damaged, with the rest ranging from moderately damaged to being full m-kills or f-kills barely holding together.

Castenea wrote:A note for those who are suggesting a use for the surrendered SLN ships, ART has two examples of 4th tier system forces.

Zunker - Hardscabble verge system, flush with cash from Wormhole discovered 15 years ago.

Total Space Navy: Little more than a double handful of LACs


Limbo - Independent system implied in text that it is an OFS client

Space Navy: two DDs, one of which is inoperable; 8 LACs all over 50 years old

How well does anyone think those two systems could utilize the surrendered ships even if they were given them?

Oh, terribly. I suppose of the scrapping cost is low enough, and the sale price to them is pitched at only a bit more than that, then they may struggle to buy it then struggle to crew and maintain it. And that may be worth it. But I'd peg that as a really, really remote proposition.

That said, there are plenty of wealthier spots that have been under the SLN (Battle Fleet or Frontier Fleet) security umbrella (in some cases, unwillingly) that have a real use for an SDF now. Bought new, a SD would be a terrible way to start that - bought very, very cheap, it may be something to consider. If they can get advisors from Erewhon or the Anderman Empire, say - I don't count Grayson or Manticore just because they are so very strapped for skilled bodies right now - or some of those SLN reservists trying to dodge Kingsford's press gangs - maybe they can get a start with one of those.

Talking these particulars, I'd suspect Zunker is likely to consider very seriously some sort of agreement with Manticore to bring it under their security umbrella. Ticking off OFS may already be something they can assume Manticore has finished up for them, and may cease to be an issue before long anyway. Zunker's not at all unlike Lynx at a somewhat longer remove. Limbo is only a little further out, counting Manticore-Beowulf and Roulette-Limbo transits and 63 lightyears between Beowulf and Roulette.

Ya know - with a political system knit together by secure control of wormhole routes and streak-drive courier boats, and with a vigorous federal structure that preserves responsible government at each level, Manticore could recreate a working government over much of what had been Solarian space. Just sayin'.

Hutch wrote:

SharkHunter wrote: Yes I am being a bad boy again and waking up an old thread involving a well-flogged dead horse. Yes, I know that we all and RFC all know that the captured Solarian SD's are about as useless as modern combatants as screen doors on a submarine, against the GA, too much to handle for Torch, etc. but...

What about Meyers? aka Admiral Henke wants the House of Thomas to look at the model for Grayson... where the RMN gave their new allies a number of captured Havenite SD's which would be quite a bit closer to a Solarian SD's in capability by comparison. Then the Grayson's started the process of upgrading their "gifted" ships to RMN standards.

Why not make the offer to parcel out a dozen or so of Crandall's SD's and do the same thing? Similar to Grayson, they've already got a deep space extraction program, trading position, etc. All of the Solarian support structure for Thurgood's BC's is still there, including some techs, and you simply assign the conversion job to whoever the House Of Thomas tells you to. Granted, Meyers still needs GA tech in system for their long range defenses, but it's still be a heckova jump start for this new ally's SDF forces.

Once they get the first ships up and running, maybe they ask for more of the SD's to continue developing a "sector defense force", maybe they don't. Should the House of Thomas go for it if an offer was made? Thoughts?

I hereby proclaim this as The Thread That Will Not Die (TTTWND). Even if the MWW does add a paragraph in the next book saying that they were sold/scrapped/used for target practice/given to allies, it won't matter. Somebody will find this old thread and bring up their 'new/brilliant" thoughts on it.

*Hutch metaphorically shoots SharkHunter in the face with a bazooka*

That rant said, it;s actually not all that bad of an idea, given 40+ of the SD's are still orbiting Spindle.

Still, there is no reason to think that a Protectorate sector will have all that many more spacers/military than the Talbott sector, and giving that sort of hardware to a place the SLN had been staging attacks on the Talbott Sector could make the Talbotters a bit nervous (and yes, it was the SLN /MAligment sending the ships, not the Meyerites (?), but still....

And that is all I'm going to say...now, where did I store that bazooka....?

Nah, Hutch, that is overkill. Let's just say 40 lashes less one with a wet noodle!!!

Don

One could always just sell them the DD or CL. The BC could be sold to the Sollie or even GA corporate executives. I suppose the SD could be used for space based system stations. With Sidewall upgrades they would be better than whatever else these lesser systems already have. Best thing is that as a measure of good will they can be given to the systems for free, as a returned to the SL Verge systems political good will.

Some of the comments about these planets trying to scrape together people to man them is down right offensive. If we had an Honorverse SD drop off a us, for free, and all we on Earth had to do was come up with 4000 people to figure out how to run it, and we already had HV LAC. Which operate on the same principles. Compared to these space faring planets which are only 2000+ years more advanced than us primitives you bet they could man and run them. Maybe not all of them but 1 or 2 or 6. No problem. Think the USA in 2000 years with 5 to 10 times the population. These are not little islands like Fiji with 30,000 people on them these are whole modern for Sollie 2000 Plus years in the future worlds.

No wonder the rest of the League thinks Manties are Neobarbs.

n7axw wrote:
Nah, Hutch, that is overkill. Let's just say 40 lashes less one with a wet noodle!!!

Don

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Spagetti or Vermicelli ?

-- Stewart

lyonheart wrote:Hi KZT,

As I recall, the 68 that created all the buzz before Crandall and Filareta's little faux pas' were essentially in one piece, enough to cause all kinds of speculation at the bar etc, intact enough we learned, to be generously returned in ART, and eagerly received.

AAC pretty much lives in my recently opened word document cache...
AAC, chapter 65 (before they get hammered by 3rd...)
"But Home Fleet had not died alone. Sebastian D'Orville mght have been taken by surprise by the weight of Second Fleet's fire, and his computation of the exchange rate might have been overly optimistic as a result, but his ships and people had struck back hard. Ninety-seven Republican ships of the wall had been destroyed outright or beaten into dead, shattered hulks. Nineteen more had lost at least one impeller ring completely. And of the remaining hundred and twenty-four SD(P)s Lester Tourville had taken into the battle, exactly eleven were undamaged."

Castenea wrote:A note for those who are suggesting a use for the surrendered SLN ships, ART has two examples of 4th tier system forces.

How well does anyone think those two systems could utilize the surrendered ships even if they were given them?

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Zunker - Hardscabble verge system, flush with cash from Wormhole discovered 15 years ago.

Total Space Navy: Little more than a double handful of LACs

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Potential as a Alliance contact; not "currently" under OFS (IIRC) but concerned about the neighbors....

I see Zunker as a possible recipient of re-tasked x-SLN DD's and CL's, possibly Gladiator CA's from Spindle capture.

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Limbo - Independent system implied in text that it is an OFS client

Space Navy: two DDs, one of which is inoperable; 8 LACs all over 50 years old


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The Limbo Navy's obvious "undying devotion to the President for Life" and Limbo's hinted at political status might make them a candidate AFTER system political and civil rights reforms, such as those Michelle discussed with the Myers Prime Minister. (likely this would require a change in the manner of government)

-- Stewart

stewart wrote:

n7axw wrote:
Nah, Hutch, that is overkill. Let's just say 40 lashes less one with a wet noodle!!!

Don

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Spagetti or Vermicelli ?

-- Stewart

I'm willing to compromise on this.

I'll shoot him with a bazooka loaded with 39 noodles...

Hi Hutch,

Compromise accepted!!!

Don