Trump Implementing the Palin. doctrin

TFLYTSNBN wrote:

Michael Everett wrote:You mean in the same way that the Bay of Pigs invasion caused Fidel Castro swing Cuba into communism?
Yep, I see the logic [/sarcasm]

You are talking to someone who grew up with neighbors who survived the ethnic cleansing of Greeks by the Ottoman Empire as well as Armenians. I also knew a victim of an islamicist homicide bombing in Turkey. I used to read him bedtime stories when I visited the Kibbutz he grew up on.

Trump is the first US President to understand that Turkey is not an ally. Trump is giving Edrogen an opportunity to convince the rest of NATO that he is a snake.

The Israelis are now wishing that they hadn't upgraded Turkey's M-60 tanks to 120mm guns.

Do you even understand the words you just spoke?

You just attempted to *justify* Trump turning US allies over to an ethnic cleansing campaign by claiming Trump uniquely understands that yes the Turks will commit atrocities against those allies and are not themselves real allies... so he decided to backstab the real allies and turn their families over to the fake allies for a slaughter to make some kind of point.

On what fucking planet is that a good thing?

Well, what are we supposed to do? Keep them from each other's throats until the end of Time? Help the Kurds conquer Turkey? That's about what it would take.

Some of those groups are still fighting over shit they did to each other 3,000 years ago. To them, World War 2 was just a brief distraction.
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gcomeau wrote:
Do you even understand the words you just spoke?

You just attempted to *justify* Trump turning US allies over to an ethnic cleansing campaign by claiming Trump uniquely understands that yes the Turks will commit atrocities against those allies and are not themselves real allies... so he decided to backstab the real allies and turn their families over to the fake allies for a slaughter to make some kind of point.

On what fucking planet is that a good thing?

Could you for once just suggest the other solution besides "doing nothing and hoping that the situation would somehow defuse itself"? Okay, let's suppose US troops were left where they were, and they (somehow) manages to deter Turkey.

What would stop Assad from coming after Kurds as soon as he would finish your beloved "democratic" opposition? The puny US garrisons? Newsflash: they have literally zero rights to even be in Syria, because A - Assad's government is now the only legitimate one, and B - US did not recognize Kurd independence.

So what would those troops do, when Assad would order them to get out or else? They have no legal reason to be here. And (should they do not obey Assad order), what would stop Syrian military from just obliterating them all? Or you forgot, that US military bombed Syria several times, causing destruction & casualties? Do you think after all your bombing and missile strikes Syrian troops would have any claims against killing American soldiers that stand on their way? They could always blame some "aligned militia" for that, after all.

So, what's you suggestion, gcomeau? Could you even think - about something constructive?

TFLYTSNBN wrote:You are talking to someone who grew up with neighbors who survived the ethnic cleansing of Greeks by the Ottoman Empire as well as Armenians. I also knew a victim of an islamicist homicide bombing in Turkey. I used to read him bedtime stories when I visited the Kibbutz he grew up on.

Trump is the first US President to understand that Turkey is not an ally. Trump is giving Edrogen an opportunity to convince the rest of NATO that he is a snake.

The Israelis are now wishing that they hadn't upgraded Turkey's M-60 tanks to 120mm guns.

Speaking as an Israeli? I'm way more worried about the US' revealed fickleness than I am about Turkey's tanks (if only because they'd need to start at least one major war before those could even reach us).

Eyal wrote:

TFLYTSNBN wrote:You are talking to someone who grew up with neighbors who survived the ethnic cleansing of Greeks by the Ottoman Empire as well as Armenians. I also knew a victim of an islamicist homicide bombing in Turkey. I used to read him bedtime stories when I visited the Kibbutz he grew up on.

Trump is the first US President to understand that Turkey is not an ally. Trump is giving Edrogen an opportunity to convince the rest of NATO that he is a snake.

The Israelis are now wishing that they hadn't upgraded Turkey's M-60 tanks to 120mm guns.

Speaking as an Israeli? I'm way more worried about the US' revealed fickleness than I am about Turkey's tanks (if only because they'd need to start at least one major war before those could even reach us).

You should be. Between the American progressive left's antisemitism streak and the growing isolationist tendencies on the right, more American pols are looking to withdraw our military back home. I doubt Trump will hang Isreal out to dry. Fauxcahantas or Bernie just might. There are other nations President Trump will hang out to dry, given a chance.

Speaking as someone who discovered his Jewish heritage late in life, I do believe it is important to distinguish between antisemitism and being critical of the actions of Israel (the Jewish State). Nothing wrong with pointing out some of the stupid and wrong actions of a nation.
Then speaking as a citizen of a country that has been the US's staunchest ally (Australia), I can point out that Trump's erratic actions have caused us to reevaluate just how much we can rely on the US to pay us back.

After your High Commissioner played his part to set up George Papadopoulos for FBI's illegal attempts to spy on a US presidential candidate, I would say Australia is 1 up on hanging the US out to dry.

Eyal wrote:

TFLYTSNBN wrote:You are talking to someone who grew up with neighbors who survived the ethnic cleansing of Greeks by the Ottoman Empire as well as Armenians. I also knew a victim of an islamicist homicide bombing in Turkey. I used to read him bedtime stories when I visited the Kibbutz he grew up on.

Trump is the first US President to understand that Turkey is not an ally. Trump is giving Edrogen an opportunity to convince the rest of NATO that he is a snake.

The Israelis are now wishing that they hadn't upgraded Turkey's M-60 tanks to 120mm guns.

Speaking as an Israeli? I'm way more worried about the US' revealed fickleness than I am about Turkey's tanks (if only because they'd need to start at least one major war before those could even reach us).

I do not think that Turkey vs Syria qualifies as a major war. Syrian territory does give Israel something that is novel for it's history, strategic depth.

Daryl wrote:Speaking as someone who discovered his Jewish heritage late in life, I do believe it is important to distinguish between antisemitism and being critical of the actions of Israel (the Jewish State). Nothing wrong with pointing out some of the stupid and wrong actions of a nation.
Then speaking as a citizen of a country that has been the US's staunchest ally (Australia), I can point out that Trump's erratic actions have caused us to reevaluate just how much we can rely on the US to pay us back.

Congratulations on discovering your heritage. I was frequently asked if I was Jewish while traveling in Israel. To the best of my knowledge, I am not. Suggesting that I might have a circumcision scar to prove a false claim that I was Jewish was an only marginally effective tactic.

Israel is in a tough situation. The Gaza strip and much of the West Bank have been transformed into an open air prison. The Palestinians are no longer even allowed to commute to work in Israel because of the threat of terrorism. Arafat turned down a two state solution because it gave him only 95% of what he claimed he wanted. What Arafat and most Palestinians want is a one state solution that creates a state of Palestine with a Jewish minority that would be exploited and exterminated.

Show me a grand strategy to preserve Jewish lives without maintaining a viable Jewish state and show me a strategy to preserve a Jewish state that doesn't require some very brutal tactics.

Of course the easiest solution is to do to the Palestinians what someone did to the Iranians back in 2000.

An interesting commentary.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ar/601285/