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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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Captain Golding
Posts: 62
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Talk of using Grav Plates in a Grave wave might not be valid - We understand that the problem with Grave Wave's is that they are Turbulent - so it's not the ships acceleration that needs to be compensated so much as the accelerations caused by the Gravitic Forces acting on the ship in the Wave. So any external accelerations caused by the Grave Wave Turbulence that exceed the Grav Plates ratings is going to putty the crew - the Shear forces must be huge and the larger the vessel the greater the issue - forces on the front won't be the same as the back. The Sails by interacting with the Grave Wave and the Compensator can work to damp out some of this. Grav Plates I suspect would lack that ability.
What we don't know is how Spider Ships work in Hyper and especially in Grav Waves. If the LD's don't have the ability to navigate Grav Waves then they are little more than Stealth Monitors. Does pulling on the Alpha Wall work if you are in the Delta Band ? If they need to have standard Sails and Compensator's on top of the Spider Drive then it just may prove that the ships have to give up to much space to drives vs armament to be successful long term. They allready lack the ability to use a strong wedge to limit their defense arcs. Now a Spider LAC as a recon ship or even SAR vessel has promise but would still be limited by tactical speed - it would quickly fall behind any current fleet and end out of position. |
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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Theemile
Posts: 5368
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Miranda Homes in mid Ohio. Unfortunately I had a job move right at the start of Covid and we bought a spec built house that had just been completed and didn't get to configure it. But my house was the 3rd in the development, and I got to watch the other 200 get built around me. I'll look through the paperwork and see if I can find the module builder for you. I envy you in the solitude. The only reason we bought this house is it backs to a 40 acre wood, so we get to enjoy watching the local deer and the rest of the wild life parade through our lawn - we even have a Bald Eagle nest about 200 feet in the woods this spring. The front is suburbia, the back is the woods. Everyone who visits us looks out the 2 story back picture windows and says "Oh, that's why you bought this house". ******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships." |
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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tlb
Posts: 4776
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According to "The Universe of Honor Harrington" in More Than Honor, the section entitled "(1) Background (General)" states the following: So for over a century, before the compensator was created, ships were traveling in gravity waves within hyperspace. It was not until 1502 pd that contra-gravity was invented. ibid:
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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Jonathan_S
Posts: 9053
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You might have a point about turbulence, though I'd been assuming that if you kept the acceleration low under sail that you'd be okay. And the quote tlb shared about pre-compensator ships with sails seems to bear that out. We do know that spider ships are capable of traveling through hyper -- the Sharks reached Manticore and Grayson that way and while the Ghosts were snuck in in a freighter I believe both classes hypered out when done with their parts of the attack. But you're right that we don't know specific details of how, or what extra limitations they might have there. Though I presume that if in the Delta bands the spider would be grabbing onto the Epsilon wall (the next higher wall), rather than the Alpha wall. RFC has strongly implied that the Spider ships can also use a wormhole; but it is less clear whether they can enter a grav wave. (We've had debates on that, partly based on the fact that Grayson sits within a small wave and we know Spider ships got there) Last edited by Jonathan_S on Wed May 21, 2025 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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tlb
Posts: 4776
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Also we have text that the tactic of Sharks tractoring together into two groups when making the transition to normal space, to simulate a known false positive signal of the gravity sensor array, was first tested by the Ghosts. From chapter 51 of Storm from the Shadows: PS: Any ship that can use a wormhole, can also enter a gravity wave; our current knowledge is that this requires sails, we wait to read what the author intends. |
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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Jonathan_S
Posts: 9053
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Oops, yes. I meant to say Sharks and instead said Spiders |
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tlb
Posts: 4776
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I have been known to call it the Shark-drive. |
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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ThinksMarkedly
Posts: 4664
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Quick note that the 1581 date has been retconned. The refit that HMS Casey CL-01 got in the late 1530s and early 1540s installed not only rail launchers for the missiles but grav plates. Casey, unlike all the other ships in the RMN at the time, had permanent up/down gravity. The grav technology was probably well-known at the time because Graf von Basaltberg remarked on the tactical use of the rail launchers for the missiles, but offered no comment on the grav plates. We know that SMS Friedrich der Grosse did not have them (yet). My guess is that he simply didn't see much of a tactical or strategic advantage to comment on something that wasn't that much of a novelty. I'm also sure there were detractors saying that having the core of the ship under zero gravity, where people could propel themselves fast with arms and legs, in 3D, was better than having people running around during battle. |
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tlb
Posts: 4776
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Interesting, but it still means that for over a century space craft traveled with a zero-gee environment, even within wormholes or gravity waves. |
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Re: pd 1924 - Shape of Beowulf's fleet | |
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Jonathan_S
Posts: 9053
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Didn't (most of?) those ships have rotational gravity? I seem to recall the rotational hab sections having to get spun down and locked for combat. If so, at least the crews of long haul freighters or long deployment warships wouldn't have been subjected to months of zero-g without a break. Many crew jobs would require working in the zero-g sections - but at minimum kitchens, mess rooms, and berthing should have been in spin gravity sections. |
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